Showing logs for date: 2018-08-15
23:23:46 <ynpvisitor45> .
04:37:36 <ynpvisitor999®> SC ie
04:57:05 <ynpvisitor999®> Lion
04:58:14 <ynpvisitor999®> Dep?
05:09:58 <Dave from B™> Good morning everyone
05:10:10 <ynpvisitor999®> morning Dave
05:14:51 <ynpvisitor999®> Castle
05:22:49 <ynpvisitor999®> hmm... Looks like Castle's a minor so far
05:49:17 <ynpvisitor999®> morning Mike
05:52:05 <Mike J> Morning 999. Morning to everyone else also.
05:52:23 <Mike J> And the most excellent news? I worked it out. I'll be in the park for four days starting next Thursday
05:52:35 <ynpvisitor999®> nice
05:53:09 <Mike J> Everyone can plan accoridngly. That almost assures none of the big ones will go off.
05:54:57 <ynpvisitor97> Great! Eric will be there, I'll be there you will be there and we will have nothing to watch. :)
05:56:03 <Dave from B™> Great news Mike and good luck! Have fun deciding where to park!
05:57:12 <Mike J> Look for the tall guy with white hair and a mustache. That's me.
05:58:53 <ynpvisitor97> Look for a short fat guy with a rolling walker, that will be me, I'm not hard to miss :)
06:05:23 <Kitt> You will be in the park Dave?
06:05:58 <Kitt> are we about due for another Steamboat wait?
06:07:13 <Dave from B™> not me
06:07:23 <Dave from B™> Joe, Mike J, Eric
06:07:40 <Dave from B™> It might be October before I get back
06:08:04 <ynpvisitor107> Cynthia and MBS back in UGB
06:08:27 <ynpvisitor107> I hope F&M goes for Cynthia today
06:08:35 <Kitt> they do that number 107
06:08:56 <ynpvisitor107> They do what?
06:09:20 <ynpvisitor999®> I personally think Hotel Steamboat will be overbooked in about a day or two, based on the last two intervals
06:09:22 <Kitt> go to the ugb
06:09:45 <ynpvisitor107> They did a SB sir a few times too
06:09:52 <Kitt> sorry space bar is sticking
06:10:10 <ynpvisitor107> SB sit
06:10:19 <ynpvisitor999®> morning Kitt and Bill
06:10:30 <Bill> Morning
06:10:49 <Bill> SB been more active lately?
06:11:20 <Kitt> don't know, been out of the park since Aug. 5th
06:11:41 <ynpvisitor107> Notes point to yes
06:11:46 <Kitt> Enjoyed the eruption on the 4th
06:12:04 <Dave from B™> Some vertical activity yesterday....seems to be progressing...who knows how quickly
06:12:16 <Kitt> I was glad everyone was where they wanted to be, since the eruption came with no warning
06:12:35 <Kitt> the minor just turned into the eruption
06:13:11 <ynpvisitor999®> morning Jimbo
06:13:53 <Jimbo Calcium> Hello.
06:14:06 <Jimbo Calcium> Is Grotto going - plume over trees?
06:14:18 <Kitt> looks like it
06:14:57 <ynpvisitor999®> there was a large plume earlier there too, so my guess is that this is either Grotto or Rocket major
06:19:34 <ynpvisitor999®> morning Kevin
06:22:20 <ynpvisitor999®> Daisy
06:25:23 <ynpvisitor999®> SC pre-eruptive steaming
06:27:28 <Kevin L™> Hi.
06:28:05 <Kevin L™> Chrome crashed on me totally last night. Had to reload it and flash. :p
06:28:27 <ynpvisitor999®> sounds fun
06:48:42 <ynpvisitor999®> Grand
06:48:50 <Kitt> Grand
06:49:08 <Mike J> Grand (Say it three times and it appears)
07:21:42 <ynpvisitor999®> morning sparekitty
07:22:08 <Dave from B™> So, I put a restaurant on credit hold because his account is up to 70 days and he gets mad at me. What is wrong with this picture?
07:22:30 <Dave from B™> And, he paid his bill a few hours later and ordered again
07:24:00 <ynpvisitor56> win-win
07:24:34 <Eric> Morning
07:24:56 <ynpvisitor56> must mean you are doing something right if he gets mad and re-orders
07:25:27 <Eric> Dave, it's a human thing, you were questioning his integrity, which all people dislike, even if they deep down, know there is an issue.
07:25:55 <ynpvisitor999®> morning Eric
07:26:59 <sparekitty> hello everyone! wednesday is looking to be great as i just booked my February 2019 stay at Snow Lodge!!
07:27:17 <Eric> Woot...congrats sparekitty
07:27:17 <Dave from B™> I'm not sure how much longer I can run this business. 33 years is a long time. I yearn for quieter days.
07:27:33 <Eric> I used to work in collections :-)
07:28:08 <Dave from B™> You couldn't pay me enough to do that every hour of every day
07:28:35 <Eric> It's actually interesting, you end up helping a lot of people through issues.
07:28:48 <ynpvisitor97> I may be all wet, but I think there was a Bee at 0343
07:29:06 <Eric> Again, all psychology, not so much brute attacks.
07:30:20 <Dave from B™> Problem is, I let accounts go and build up...anger increases and then I've had enough...not the way to collect bills. That is why I have an assistant who is great at it.
07:31:11 <Dave from B™> But when people don't listen to her, they get me
07:32:53 <Mike J> Dave, that is why my dad (a professional photographer) put my mom in charge of much of the financial side.
07:33:10 <Eric> Haha...yep, you have to be the one to balance the clients worth and how much credit and good faith you are willing to extend.
07:33:56 <ynpvisitor97> My family was in wholesale beer distributing, now you want to talk about having to deal with a bunch of deadbeats :-)
07:34:32 <Dave from B™> 97, I bet. My father almost got into that business about 45 years ago and decided not to.
07:35:28 <Dave from B™> When I make the decision to get involved in collections, I've basically decided that I'm willing to lose the customer at that point
07:35:30 <ynpvisitor97> He did a very wise thing
07:36:16 <ynpvisitor97> DG, you still here?
07:36:40 <ynpvisitor999®> I am
07:37:12 <ynpvisitor67> Time for Aurum.
07:37:20 <ynpvisitor97> check the overnight at 0343 please may be Bh
07:37:29 <ynpvisitor999®> sure
07:39:47 <ynpvisitor999®> that's the 0343 Lion
07:39:53 <ynpvisitor67> But what is he goingt to do when the fish comes COD?
07:39:56 <Dave from B™> I hope F&M goes today and we see more progression at Steamboat
07:40:04 <ynpvisitor97> thanks
07:40:10 <Dave from B™> 67, haha
07:45:11 <Eric> F&M will probably go on Friday as I am driving toward the park!
07:45:23 <Eric> along with SB
07:46:30 <Dave from B™> You need it to go today, Eric!
07:46:49 <Eric> we are 16 hours away from this F&M interval being the longest in the last 7
08:23:24 <ynpvisitor8> bhi
08:23:24 <ynpvisitor8> .
08:23:25 <ynpvisitor8> .
08:23:25 <ynpvisitor8> ..
08:23:29 <ynpvisitor999®> wee
08:23:37 <Kevin L™> Yea!
08:23:42 <Dave from B™> nice
08:23:45 <ynpvisitor67> Not going to see Aurum now!
08:24:33 <Mike J> This is when I like that my feed is delayed. You guys tell me it is happening. Then I can watch as it happens (including people's reactions)
08:28:09 <Kitt> yay, I unfroze my screen
08:30:19 <Dave from B™> Kitt, you getting the itch to go back?
08:30:53 <ynpvisitor42> oh you mean so I don't have to argue with my computer?
08:31:11 <ynpvisitor42> I am enjoying my break
08:32:05 <Dave from B™> I'm glad you're enjoying your break. How's Bill doing?
08:32:52 <ynpvisitor42> Keeping busy running all over the state
08:33:17 <ynpvisitor42> Lots of rig moves, etc.
08:34:46 <ynpvisitor67> Geysers are fun. How come BH has a cone, and Indy does not?
08:35:13 <ynpvisitor999®> maybe because Indy is a relatively recent development?
08:35:58 <Kitt> Go Beehive
08:36:16 <ynpvisitor999®> :bee:
08:36:27 <ynpvisitor67> Waiting, Waiting, Waiting
08:36:38 <Kitt> It is so fuzzy looking since the area is smokey
08:36:49 <ynpvisitor67> Weeeeee
08:41:50 <ynpvisitor67> Well that was fun. Enjoy Aurum
08:42:01 <ynpvisitor999®> LC
09:30:05 <Eric> Hope you have a room by now Dave :-D
09:35:59 <Dave from B™> Life's been hectic today...no chance to call but I will look soon...I see lots of emails
10:13:28 <Betty> hi all
10:14:07 <ynpvisitor999®> evening Betty
10:14:24 <Betty> evening DG
10:28:59 <Betty> OF
10:50:12 <J. Copernicium> Now that's what I call alchemy.
10:51:13 <Betty> hi Jimbo
10:51:30 <J. Copernicium> Guten tag Betty
11:08:25 <ynpvisitor999®> Castle
11:19:21 <Betty> Daisy
11:19:46 <Kevin L™> Stereo!
11:24:14 <ynpvisitor999®> looks like a major
11:24:55 <Kevin L™> Or at least a high ranking captain.
11:25:44 <ynpvisitor999®> fair enough :)
11:29:12 <Kevin L™> Bursts like that it may be a Lt Colonel.
11:34:27 <J. Copernicium> You guys are reminding me of names of curveballs; Uncle Charlie or Lord Charles
11:36:11 <Kevin L™> Well SB has thrown us a few curve balls.
11:36:28 <J. Copernicium> And change-ups
11:37:16 <Kevin L™> Gee, 12 miles of I-11 opened Thursday afternoon and in less than 5 days it has two fatalities.
11:40:24 <J. Copernicium> What's the speed limit? 85?
11:40:57 <ynpvisitor999®> They're probably testing how long it takes for emergency services to arrive
11:42:02 <Kevin L™> I think it is either 65 or 70. Some mental midget proved Darwin correct when he tried to make a u turn on a freeway. Duh!
11:46:55 <J. Copernicium> Fastest I ever drove was from Santa Fe NM to Albuquerque. Didn't feel safe at 80, too slow.
11:47:28 <Kevin L™> You sound like a German.
11:47:50 <Betty> hehehe
11:48:17 <J. Copernicium> I do not usually drive that fast.
11:48:51 <J. Copernicium> But the speed limit there is like 75 mph.
11:49:47 <Kevin L™> I remember driving with a guy from Hanau to Kaiserlautern (about 110 miles) including some city traffic. Made it in less than an hour. Don't know in MPH what 250 kmph is, but we were doing that.
11:50:04 <ynpvisitor999®> 155 mph
11:50:41 <Kevin L™> You didn't need a seatbelt. Your butt was so puckered it never would have come off the seat.'
11:51:11 <Kevin L™> He had a Porsche BTW.
11:51:39 <Dave from B™> Montana limit is 80 in unpopulated areas
11:51:54 <Dave from B™> on interstates only
11:52:19 <ynpvisitor999®> speed limit here is 130 kmh/80 mph or 120 kmh/75 mph, depending on which highway you use. And yes, the speed limit is enforced relatively strictly. If you drive 30 mph faster than allowed, your driver's license is revoked for a certain amount of time
11:52:48 <ynpvisitor999®> 50 kmh/30 mph*
11:53:00 <Kevin L™> Nevada is 75 (70 on non Interstate). Since I designed some Interstates I know the design speed for most of them is 70. I will keep it 70 or below.
11:53:18 <ynpvisitor999®> and you get a hefty fine on top of that too
11:53:39 <Betty> we have highways without speedlimit, but most common is 130/120 kmh
11:54:27 <ynpvisitor999®> highways without speed limit in Germany isn't a myth? Today I learned :D
11:54:50 <Betty> no it´s real
11:54:55 <Kevin L™> I know there was no speed limit on the Autobahn when we did that run. Nevada used to have a "reasonable and proper" speed limit for rural highways before the 55 fiasco. They would cite you for reckless driving if you did over 90.
11:54:59 <Dave from B™> That's crazy
11:55:59 <Kevin L™> Germans know how to drive though. They are very good. No cup holders in their cars. When you drive, you drive. Nothing else.
11:56:44 <ynpvisitor999®> same goes for the Netherlands (except for those who think a road on a dyke is a racetrack)
11:57:52 <Betty> not true Kevin. We have cupholders
11:59:07 <ynpvisitor34> Montana had no speed limit for a long time
11:59:21 <Kevin L™> They didn't then.
11:59:35 <Dave from B™> It's happened a couple times in history in MT
11:59:38 <ynpvisitor34> Driving 90 on Interstate was no big deal
12:00:09 <Dave from B™> Traffic has gotten to the point that unlimited or reasonable doesn't fit Montana
12:02:50 <ynpvisitor999®> OF ns
12:03:45 <Dave from B™> What is a regular F&M cycle? I know what an event cycle is
12:04:32 <Betty> the same without splashing in Main Vent?
12:04:52 <ynpvisitor999®> SB hasn't improved much since yesterday
12:05:37 <Kevin L™> Waiting for Eric
12:05:55 <Betty> GO ERIC
12:06:16 <Dave from B™> Eric wants the other 2
12:06:32 <Betty> I can relate
12:06:54 <Kevin L™> Don't think he would complain
12:07:04 <Betty> I´m hoping for Giant and F&M too
12:08:00 <Betty> I´m sure hooked by the F&M I saw
12:08:47 <Kevin L™> F&M is awesome. Giantess is also good.
12:09:19 <Betty> I don´t even dare to think of this one :-)
12:10:03 <Betty> would love to get an Aurum
12:11:02 <Kevin L™> That may be harder than F&M
12:11:07 <Dave from B™> Betty, where else are you going this trip to the US?
12:20:52 <Dave from B™> Betty, did you doze off?:)
12:21:57 <Betty> not many new spots, LV directly to Yellowstone via Idaho Falls, and on the way back via Great Basin Ntl Park and Zion
12:22:28 <Dave from B™> Sounds fun
12:22:56 <Betty> maybe Craters of the Moon
12:23:18 <Kevin L™> Be sure to see the railroad museum in Ely. Like an old west shortline.
12:26:58 <Kevin L™> Also do Cathedral Gorge (right off US 93) and Rainbow Canyon.
12:28:00 <Betty> not too much time left after Yellowstone
12:35:32 <Kevin L™> Cathedral Gorge is about an hour and Rainbow Canyon is about 90m. These two are really fun. If you are going through Ely you can stop by the museum in about a half hour. It isn't one of the must do things if you are not a railroad fan. You may want to drive through the town of Pioche which is an old mining town. Takes about 10m more than doing US93.
12:43:43 <GO SOMETHING> anything?
12:43:50 <Kevin L™> Here is a link about Pioche and there is a link to Rainbow Canyon also. https://www.exploringnevada.com/towns/pioche.php
12:49:02 <Betty> thx, Kevin
12:50:55 <Dave from B™> Go something? Not sure where your allegiance lies today Graham?
12:52:56 <Dave from B™> Hi Grand
12:52:58 <Dave from B™> ..
12:53:19 <Kevin L™> Tall
12:57:46 <GO SOMETHING> just one series of 5 Grands in 24h ... this last one missed it by 6min
12:59:12 <Betty> I hate updates
13:00:43 <J. Copernicium> Windows, Betty?
13:01:08 <Betty> yep
13:01:10 <Kevin L™> I don't know what they did yesterday but mine crashed. i had to uninstall Chrome and reinstall it. I also had to do a new installof Flash.
13:01:21 <Kevin L™> Took forever.
13:01:46 <J. Copernicium> My Outlook collapsed. Updates cost me at least 30 minutes.
13:01:47 <GO SOMETHING> looks like F&M and Steamboat are in a race to see which can come in last
13:01:53 <Betty> seems to be ok now
13:01:56 <J. Copernicium> Got caught up on some reading
13:02:27 <J. Copernicium> When was the last Grand multi-burst?
13:02:36 <Dave from B™> F&M will go before Steamobat
13:03:29 <ynpvisitor27> will they both go in the dark?
13:04:39 <Dave from B™> 27, do you want me to predict everything for you?:D
13:04:49 <GO SOMETHING> haha probably whenever one can persuade the other to lose and erupt first
13:05:43 <GO SOMETHING> looks like steamboat is going slow this recovery and Carol is waiting at F&M which is not cooperating either
13:05:56 <GO SOMETHING> maybe Giant will be next
13:07:13 <GO SOMETHING> to Eric - if Steamboat looks good i would go there over Giant. Giant has more chances in general than Steamboat which may not be active again until we are dead
13:07:35 <Dave from B™> Eric has seen Steamobat already
13:07:47 <GO SOMETHING> i know, but he may never see it again
13:08:00 <GO SOMETHING> whereas if he stays watching geysers he has better chance for Giant
13:08:25 <GO SOMETHING> i would have seen a lot more Splendid eruptions if I understood how rare it was
13:09:00 <Kevin L™> Problem with Splendid is it would not go unless the weather was real crap.
13:09:07 <GO SOMETHING> but we all make our choices...
13:09:18 <GO SOMETHING> thats not true Kevin
13:09:18 <Betty> I would have seen a lot more Plumes if I understood how rare it was
13:10:02 <GO SOMETHING> in 1887 it just had series every few days pretty much regardless of weather
13:10:13 <GO SOMETHING> or 1997
13:10:39 <Dave from B™> Graham, I didn't know you were that old
13:10:47 <Dave from B™> You've aged well
13:10:55 <GO SOMETHING> why thank you :)
13:11:05 <Kevin L™> I spent a lot of time out there in the pouring rain. It was worth it.
13:11:22 <GO SOMETHING> Marie Wolf made the comment that she couldnt understand why more people weren't watching SPlendid that year
13:11:26 <Kevin L™> In Dog years Dave is dead.
13:11:56 <GO SOMETHING> i am sure it also erupted in crappy weather
13:12:05 <GO SOMETHING> but i hjave some nice blue sky photos
13:12:17 <GO SOMETHING> including the huge one seen from Oblong
13:12:20 <Dave from B™> I wqish I would have realized the rarity of Cascade when I saw part of an eruption
13:12:35 <GO SOMETHING> ah, yeah that was fun
13:13:09 <GO SOMETHING> confused the heck out of people when it erupted in the middle of a plume eruption
13:13:31 <GO SOMETHING> plume burst.......then another surprised people, then the watch Plume and Cascade erupts
13:13:45 <GO SOMETHING> then plume butrsts...they dont know which way to look
13:14:13 <Dave from B™> I saw a partial Cascade from near OF. How is the view from GH?
13:14:37 <GO SOMETHING> best view is from Chinese Spring
13:14:52 <GO SOMETHING> you see the eruption and cascade down the hill
13:15:00 <Dave from B™> That makes sense...did it give any warning of an impending eruption?
13:15:19 <GO SOMETHING> no that i remember but i bet it put some water out
13:15:35 <GO SOMETHING> that was 1998 i think
13:17:07 <Dave from B™> Splendid sounds fun
13:18:29 <ynpvisitor999®> Lion ini
13:19:10 <ynpvisitor999®> needs more jumper cables
13:19:27 <Betty> ít´s fun
13:20:10 <ynpvisitor999®> I have to say that this is a short end of series-initial interval, compared to earlier series
13:20:55 <GO SOMETHING> watch out for Giantess :)
13:21:19 <GO SOMETHING> interetsing Giant erupted the night that Grotto had the Rocket Major just after the start
13:23:04 <Eric> Well, I hope they all wait for me :-D
13:23:38 <Eric> I would like to schedule a Steamboat on Sunday, F&M Monday and Giant can go on Tuesday.
13:23:52 <Eric> All mid-morning please.
13:24:03 <ynpvisitor116> with a light breeze away
13:24:09 <Eric> exactly!
13:24:11 <Dave from B™> Graham, can you make that happen?
13:24:23 <ynpvisitor116> shouldn't be a problem
13:24:33 <GO SOMETHING> yes.......Sept 16, 17, 18
13:24:37 <ynpvisitor116> since that's happened zero times in the history of ever
13:24:41 <GO SOMETHING> 2018
13:24:58 <Betty> hey what about me???
13:25:00 <GO SOMETHING> we had them all within 24h before ....
13:25:04 <Dave from B™> 116, they erupted within 20 hours of each other...anything is possible
13:25:05 <Eric> good qualifier Graham :-P
13:25:33 <Dave from B™> Betty, you are on suspension:)
13:25:33 <GO SOMETHING> how about 23, 24, 25 for a repeat Betty? 2018
13:25:57 <Betty> ok, I´ll buy that
13:26:34 <GO SOMETHING> now Dave can do his planning
13:29:04 <Eric> I am telling you, look for SB and F&M eruptions on Friday, the day before I get there!
13:32:18 <Dave from B™> ok...F&M today or tomorrow. Steamboat Fri or Sat, Giant Sun or Mon...right it down:)
13:32:33 <Dave from B™> write*
13:33:11 <GO SOMETHING> looks like you will have nice cool weather Eric
13:33:27 <Betty> time to get some sleep, night all
13:33:41 <Kevin L™> night
13:34:39 <GO SOMETHING> remember Eric wanted Steamboat before F&M
13:42:18 <ynpvisitor999®> Daisy
13:46:00 <ynpvisitor999®> SC
13:46:56 <ynpvisitor999®> that's nice bursting
14:00:15 <GO SOMETHING> i see you left Aurum for me today Kevin
14:00:46 <Kevin L™> I am off today.
14:01:11 <GO SOMETHING> i still blame you
14:01:20 <ynpvisitor97> I hope you get to feeling better
14:03:07 <Dave from B™> Time to head out. Have a great evening. Let's hope for a daylight F&M
14:03:12 <ynpvisitor999®> night Dave
14:03:49 <Kevin L™> Night Dave
14:07:52 <Kevin L™> Well if I left aurm for you, make it erupt!
14:08:30 <GO SOMETHING> haha
14:09:35 <GO SOMETHING> 1 month today :)
14:14:32 <Kevin L™> Go Sprinkler
14:25:28 <GO SOMETHING> theres an escaped llama in the Snake River district ..... thats unusual wildlife :)
14:33:12 <Kevin L™> Bet the wolves would know what to do with that!
14:34:05 <ynpvisitor999®> that's a weak Lion
15:21:45 <ynpvisitor999®> apparantly Fountain had an "unusually powerful eruption", per minissa
15:27:34 <ynpvisitor999®> almost time for Lion
15:33:58 <GO SOMETHING> hitting the boardwalk isnt unusual
15:34:18 <GO SOMETHING> lc
15:34:51 <GO SOMETHING> not sure how they mesured the height tho
15:35:06 <Eric> F&M doesn't like the dry heat apparently
15:35:59 <ynpvisitor8> I agree. Sounds like it was a nice eruption but the description doesn't sound that unusually powerful.
15:36:56 <Eric> Yep, typical fountain...awesome!
15:39:11 <ynpvisitor999®> Lion
15:39:47 <ynpvisitor999®> garbage start
15:43:44 <ynpvisitor999®> it wouldn't surprise me this Lion is the last one in the series
15:44:45 <GO SOMETHING> the Ftn description sounds likema big one tho ... who knows if the height is right
15:45:04 <GO SOMETHING> 100' would be powerful by my standards
15:45:41 <ynpvisitor999®> I hope one of the gazers familiar with Fountain was there too
15:48:13 <ynpvisitor999®> I don't standing on the edge of SC's crater is something you want to do, bird
15:48:28 <ynpvisitor999®> ugh... words
15:55:29 <ynpvisitor999®> SC steaming/erupting
16:08:34 <ynpvisitor999®> I'm calling it a day. Have fun watching Lion (if it goes), the treeline and Giantess' shoulder
16:09:08 <GO SOMETHING> thanks. goodnight
16:13:30 <Kevin L™> Night
16:14:18 <Kevin L™> Well they got one of my favorite train cams back online. My two favorites were taken out by lightning. :(
16:14:27 <Kevin L™> Daisy
16:27:03 <Kevin L™> .Smoke looks bad tonight
16:27:28 <GO SOMETHING> hopefully they get rain this weekend
16:53:38 <GO SOMETHING> GHP
16:53:46 <GO SOMETHING> weak one
17:07:28 <Kevin L™> This looks better than the last one
17:21:32 <Kevin L™> 6.6 eq at Tanaga Volcano Alaska
17:51:36 <GO SOMETHING> sc
18:04:17 <ynpvisitor100> OF
18:04:30 <ynpvisitor100> I must be lagged.
18:19:54 <GO SOMETHING> goodnight
18:20:08 <Kevin L™> Good Knight.
18:44:52 <Kevin L™> Grand
18:46:07 <ynpvisitor97> Daisy
19:16:06 <Kevin L™> Pretty sky even for this dark.
19:36:39 <Kevin L™> Northern lights will be low tonight.
20:09:09 <ynpvisitor23> Time for F&M?